Unfortunately he neglects to mention other bas-reliefs which show "fish-deer" and "fish-lions" and which consequently suggest that the fish motif was symbolic, not descriptive. A critical analysis has to investigate the accuracy of such claims, so as to judge the validity of the book's conclusions. They conclude that Temple was very keen to please his mentor, who believed in extraterrestrial beings from Sirius. Used under aCreative Commons license. the sky and the center of Dogon mythology. Any planet that close would make Venus, with an average temperature of 450C (840F), look cool and comfortable by comparison. September 1976 saw In reply Temple produces evidence for the great antiquity of the Sirius cult. WebRe: Dogon Sirius claim debunked - Graham Hancock Official Website Mysteries Taken from [ library.thinkquest.org] According to the Dogon priests, Sirius is orbited by a tiny secret star that they refer to as 'po', which traces an elliptical path around Sirius taking 50 years to He points out that the Dogon myths also describe a third star (astronomers would call it "Sirius C"), as yet undiscovered. Scientists learn that the Dogon do not possess secret knowledge about the star Sirius and its companions. The antiquity of the Dogon astronomy is not so obvious as ancient astronaut enthusiasts claim but neither has it been disproved. Concludes Sagan, "There are too many loopholes, too many alternate explanations for such a myth to provide reliable evidence of past extraterrestrial contact. Temple claims that bas-reliefs of the Sumerian demigod Oannes, which depict a "fish man," prove Nommo, whom the author identifies as the ancestor of the Dogon Nommo myths, was an amphibious extraterrestrial. The Symbolism of the Tarot: The Minor Arcana, The Symbolism of the Tarot: The Major Arcana, My Reading with Kristine from Psychic Source Review, Get the best Psychic Reading Ever Best Psychics Ive Reviewed, The Cathars: the struggle for and of a new Church, The Strange Stone Discs of Baian-Kara-Ula, William Blake: What paintings of visions come. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Sagan has recounted numerous examples from Arizona and New Guinea -- and other scholars have noted similar instances -- of the rapid assimilation of new stories, songs and lore into the eclectic mythology of Stone Age peoples. It has a mass of 2.35 times the mass of the Sun. Nor does he establish a connection between the Dogon creator Nommo and the star Sirius. Ideas originally published in 1948, reprint (Oxford University Press 1997). Also if it was seeded by westerners how is the Dogon and surrounding tribes have a fully developed culture and religion structure centered around Sirius going back for hundreds of years? The Dogon have a traditional interest in the sky and astronomical phenomena. 6, "White Did Oberg? The diagram that Temple presents, however, is not the Temple's theory is heavily based on his interpretation of the work of ethnographers Marcel Griaule and Germaine Dieterlen. New evidence deals a devastating blow to what was considered to be the best case for extraterrestrial visitation. I published, showed the distances to be nowhere close, in error by tens of miles, at least ten percent -- hardly "immense accuracy. This of course would destroy the modern influence explanation totally. So much for the Nommos. this about a star that cannot be seen without telescopes, and he made no Paranormal, ed. "Legends of the Dogon: belief in a long-solved star" (Sirius B) and describe its density and rotational to other visible stars near Sirius as recognition of the invisible If a European had visited the Dogon in the 1920's and 1930's, conversation would likely have turned to astronomical matters, including Sirius, the brightest star in the sky and the center of Dogon mythology. Figure 1. have turned to astronomical matters, including Sirius, the brightest star in Griaule and Dieterlen first described their findings in an article published in French in 1950, but they included no comment about how extraordinary the Dogon knowledge of the invisible companions was. This is a complicated issue, because several special interest groups each claim the Dogon for their own. The ancient records are filled with unanswered astronomical questions -- including the "red Sirius" and the possible Sumerian Ea-Oannes references to the spectacular Vela-X supernova. The legend of the Dogons astronomical precociousness first appeared on the radar in the 1970s. Subscribe to eSkeptic: our free email newsletter and get great podcasts, videos, reviews and articles from Skeptic magazine, announcements, and more in your inbox once or twice a week. Dogon descriptions of Jupiter, Saturn and Sirius remind one of Jonathan Swift's uncanny description of the two undiscovered moons of Mars. Nigel Appleby whose book Hall of the Gods was withdrawn from publication has admitted to being tremendously influenced by Temples Sirius Mystery. One example: "If a Sirius-C is ever discovered and found to be a red dwarf, I will conclude that the Dogon information has been fully validated." The Dogon and Sirius. civilization. Liam is the author of Urban Astronomy and is a Senior Scientist for Skeptic. by Liam McDaid. extraterrestrials, the Nommos, some 5,000 years ago. Also it would take a very good set of lenses to see Sirius B, which has an apparent magnitude of 8.44 and a separation from Sirius A of 10 arcseconds (0.3% of a 1 angle) under the best conditions. The Sirius Mystery is a book written by Robert K. G. Temple (born Robert Kyle Grenville Temple in 1945) supporting the pseudoscientific[1] ancient astronauts hypothesis that intelligent extraterrestrial beings visited the Earth and made contact with humans in antiquity and prehistoric times. He certainly did not have permission to use that statement as part of the promotion, I'11 just have to be even more careful hereafter.". Sirius. (OK, but if it's not true then Temple may suddenly discover that, as in another similar case, "the Dogon information must be not only garbled (or perhaps concealed in line with a secretive tradition) but only partially true." Temples response to criticism has so far been evasive. Seeking Clarity? The Dogon are supposed to have known that Sirius B orbits Sirius and that a complete orbit takes The brightest star in the sky is Sirius, now called Sirius A. York: Random House, 1995). Griaule, Marcel. To quote Ancient Mysteries: While Temple, following Griaule, assumes that to polo is the invisible star Sirius B, the Dogon themselves, as reported by Griaule, say something quite different. To quote the Dogon: When Digitaria (to polo) is close to Sirius, the latter becomes brighter; when it is at its most distant from Sirius, Digitaria gives off a twinkling effect, suggesting several stars to the observer. This description of a very visible effect causes James and Thorpe to wonder as anyone reading this should do whether to polo is therefore an ordinary star near Sirius, not an invisible companion, as Griaule and Temple suggest. MANY SKEPTICS WOULD LIKE TO THINK THAT ONCE SOMETHING IS debunked, that will be the end of it. WebThe star Sirius is certainly no stranger to mysteries. earth as a spherical body in space and projections upon it envisaged as part ofthe Sirius tore." Though Temples work was challenged, at its core lay the original anthropological study of the Dogon by Griaule and Dieterlen, who describe the secret knowledge of Sirius B and Sirius C in their own book The Pale Fox. by Philip Coppens. WebRe: Dogon Sirius claim debunked - Graham Hancock Official Website Mysteries Taken from [ library.thinkquest.org] According to the Dogon priests, Sirius is orbited by a tiny secret star that they refer to as 'po', which traces an elliptical path around Sirius taking 50 years to The good news is that two of the first five entries were from skeptical websites (CSICOP and Bob Carrolls Skeptics Dictionary). Such is the case with the Dogon a West African people and their supposed advanced and inexplicable knowledge of the stars Sirius A and Sirius B. Sirius A is the brightest star in our sky. But didn't Isaac Asimov check over the book for just such factual errors, as the publisher claims? He shows a total ignorance or disregard for almost every fact in my book, and there is hardly a single thing in his review which is remotely accurate." found no evidence they knew Sirius was a double star or that Sirius B is The obviously advanced astronomical knowledge must have come from somewhere, but is it an ancient bequest or a modern graft? thousands of similar objects along with even heavier and denser objects such as neutron stars and black holes. Especially those who believe that our past is not at all how mainstream historians believe it to be, or indeed, tell us it was. The brightest star in the sky is Sirius, now called Sirius A. technological societies located on planet earth. space. This is strange, because one would think that it would be a major discovery in anthropology. The Skeptics Society is a non-profit, Sagan, Carl 1980. Unfortunately the ancient records contain no clear, unambiguous references to this Sirius lore although the works of historians, astronomers and philosophers were explicit and detailed on innumerable other subjects. Legends of the Dogon Belief in a Long-Solved Mystery Resurfaces. The Dogon also knew Sirius B was about the size of Earth and spun on its axis. Webplanet earth. The Dogon are a people of about 100,000 who dwell in western Africa. [12] According to Oberg, the Dogons' astronomical information resembled the knowledge and speculations of late 1920s Europe, suggesting that the Dogon were influenced by European visitors before their mythology was recorded in the 1930s. Nevertheless the Sumerian Oannes myths, first described by Sagan and Shklovskiy in Intelligent Life in the Universe in 1966, are as intriguing as ever. At least three are farther and at least one of them has rings too. (In response, Temple has drawn up the ridiculous image of natives laborously hauling a giant instrument through the west African mud -- when in fact a four inch reflector would do just fine, and I once owned one that weighed about ten pounds including mount.) Europeans too talked about the discovery of a third star in the Sirius system; later investigations, however, ruled out that possibility. Temple's book and the debates that followed its release publicized the existence of the Dogon tribe among many New Age followers and proponents of ancient astronaut theories. In the 1930s, when their research was carried out, Sirius B was known to have existed, even though it was only photographed in 1970. Ogotemmeli: An Introduction to Dogon Religious And if all this were not enough for the Sirians, recent studies have suggested the possibility of a third star (Sirius C) orbiting Sirius B, although it would be a very low mass star which so far has escaped detection.5 Stable planetary orbits may be very hard to find in the Sirian system. It is important to look at the assumptions and implications of the claims made about the Dogon. Myths and legends that are passed through generations are thousands of years old. characteristics. For Siwa, I called Dr. Farouk EI-Baz of the National Air and Space Museum in Washington, and his maps showed it at 25.50 degE, 29.22 degN (that's the oasis center, with the modern town about ten kilometers SE). E. "Ancient Astronauts," in, McDaid, Liam. The Dogon were in fact aware of the fact that Sirius is a binary system (i.e. Cook some soul food. James and Thorpe understate the problem when they say this is very worrying. Griaule claimed that about 15 per cent of the Dogon tribe possessed this secret knowledge, but Van Beek could find no trace of it in the decade he spent with the Dogon. 2Q9-mV5F W4g?`Su#q6a]sdaGr*_70 ! ;`~RS)Hm@FGI.m3gcW|PF.(`VypT!]WM6'b//^FX[P\9:H37)DH,y|F(&Da]w o9-K?MR+z.R}7.ubqUIXVy~frF@". Worse still, hundreds of thousands of years ago, Sirius B was a dying red giant. Especially those who believe that our past is not at all how mainstream historians believe it to be, or indeed, tell us it was. Webplanet earth. Sagan, Carl. The Dogon understanding of astronomy was comparatively modern but has several known misconceptions - it entirely lines up with the European understanding as of the late 19th and early 20th centuries, before the discovery of relativity. [2][1] The book was first published by St. Martin's Press in 1976. On this episode of MonsterTalk we chat with archeologist Dr. Ken Feder about giants, biblical archeology and one of the biggest hoaxes in American history. The review was indeed consequently modified in parts where Temple explained portions of his book I may have misinterpreted. It is a type of fuel that can lead to what Clay Farris Naff cleverly calls the neuron bomb. In this post, Michael Shermer asks, Is there a moral standard that stands above all the worlds religions that is based on some transcendent source?. Myths and legends that are passed through generations are thousands of years old. terrestrial rather than extraterrestrial. had visited the Dogon in the 1920's and 1930's, conversation would likely Griaule and Dieterlen's claims, to fit his fantastic story. WebThe population numbers between 400,000 and 800,000.. . The Dogon and Sirius. Robert Temple, who spent eight years studying mythology, is convinced that he can trace the Sirius-B information back to the Sumerians. sources for Temple's story. Some might argue that if there were a planet really close to Sirius A, it could be in a stable orbit. The book presents the hypothesis that the Dogon people of Mali, in West Africa, preserve a tradition of contact with intelligent extraterrestrial beings from the Sirius star system. "We have in the Dogon information a predictive mechanism which it is our duty to test, regardless of our preconceptions." WebThe Dogon, the Nommos and Sirius B Artist's conception of the Dogon's legendary Nommos. [15] An apparent "third star" observed in the 1920s is now confirmed as a background object,[16] something previously suggested by Holberg in 2007: Benest and Duvent found that stable orbits with a period of up to six years exist around Sirius A. It would appear that the Dogon had extensive knowledge of the Sirius star system before the outside world had a chance to give it to them. I have never completely understood Temple's complaint to "Astronomy" about my critiques: "I could not object to a review of a book which was fair, honest, or intelligent, no matter how critical or damning it might be of the opinions expressed in the book or the quality of work behind the book. Temples solution referred to legends of a mythical creature, the god Oannes, who might have been an extraterrestrial, described as descending to Earth from the stars to bring civilising wisdom to the Dogon forefathers. Cuddle up with someone. This would have wreaked havoc on the climate of any planets orbiting Sirius A. Legends of the Dogon Belief in a Long-Solved Mystery Resurfaces. 11.1. WebRe: Dogon Sirius claim debunked - Graham Hancock Official Website Mysteries Taken from [ library.thinkquest.org] According to the Dogon priests, Sirius is orbited by a tiny secret star that they refer to as 'po', which traces an elliptical path around Sirius taking 50 years to As Picknett and Prince have been able to show, Temples arguments are often based on erroneous readings of encyclopdia entries and misrepresentations of ancient Egyptian mythology. For more then 20 years, The Sirius Mystery has influenced speculation about the possibility that our forefathers came from the stars. The only mystery is how anyone could take seriously either the notion of 2000. (Copyright Lee Krystek 1998) In Mali, West Africa, lives a tribe of people called the Dogon. Ridpath concludes that any information that resembles the facts about Sirius was probably ascertained by way of cultural contamination. The second problem is that ancient writers seemed to use color for stars in a way different from the way that we do (they described Pollux, Arcturus, and Capella as red a modern observer would call them yellow-orange, orange, and yellow, respectively). The Dogon have a traditional interest in the sky and astronomical phenomena. Precise maps at the NASA space photo interpretation lab in Houston list "Behdet" as an ancient name for modern Damanhur, located today at 31.03 degN, 30.28 degE, i.e., more than a hundred kilometers away from where Temple locates his "Behdet" at 31.50 degN, 31.23 degE. %PDF-1.4 ch. that by the time Griaule arrived, the Dogon may have had a grounding in 20th (Copyright Lee Krystek 1998) In Mali, West Africa, lives a tribe of people called the Dogon. Melanin Conference, San Francisco, September 16-17, 1987"). At the latitude of Egypt, over distances of several hundred kilometers, planetary curvature introduces distortions only on the order of fractions of kilometers, not the tens of kilometers worth of inaccuracies I found in Temple's claim. WebThe Dogon, the Nommos and Sirius B Artist's conception of the Dogon's legendary Nommos. Young was a fervent believer in the Council of Nine, a mysterious group of channelled entities that claim to be the nine creator gods of ancient Egypt. African Observers of the Universe: The Sirius Question. In, Ortiz de Montellano, Bernard R. 1996. In this weeks eSkeptic, Liam McDaid examines these claims. Except that this isnt the original Dogon drawing. They observe that information about the odd invisible companion of Sirius had been widely published in Europe years before Europeans recorded the Dogon myths. Perhaps so -- it does seem like a trivial point, arguing over how different two meaningless geographical distances really are. [6] The claims about the Dogons' astronomical knowledge have also been challenged. Just when multi-cellular life would began, Sirius A would become a Red Giant, crisping any nearby planets. The Nommos descended from the sky in a vessel accompanied by fire and thunder. based his account on an interview with one person, Ambara, and an https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sirius_Mystery. different civilizations thousands of miles or thousands of years apart and to other equally questionable tactics. History Debunked then goes on to demonstrate the type of pseudo-scientific nonsense this has lead to by providing a link to an Ethnomathematics paper and reading out its conclusion. The Dogon. Whew! Webplanet earth. Zeta Reticuli 2 (with about the same temperature and mass as the Sun) is another candidate. As the brightest star in the sky it was known and worshiped by ancient civilizations. Found in the constellation after which it is named, it is about 25,000 light years from the sun and 42,000 light years from the centre of the Milky Way. The number "fifty" has great signifance in ancient myths. MANY SKEPTICS WOULD LIKE TO THINK THAT ONCE SOMETHING IS debunked, that will be the end of it. S]V',H79aD>1 Q@d(FOY;"36y0Z{VXEJwOx._tto}#&i|HR-i4 They all have one thing in common: enormous monsters. I did more searching and found that for the keywords Dogon and Sirius B, almost 1000 websites were listed. Other ancient astronomical records make no mention of Sirius being red. (2004). sigui, held by the Dogon every sixty years. van Beek, Walter E. A. The Nommos descended from the sky in a vessel accompanied by fire and thunder. Its appearance in the dawn sky over Egypt warned of the impending Nile floods and the summer's heat and marked the beginning of the Egyptian calendar. Sirius B was first observed in 1862, and had been predicted in 1844 on dynamic grounds. ", Investigating The other five are still seen as red but from the time of Arab astronomers to the present day Sirius has been blue-white. The "mystery" that is central to the book is how the Dogon allegedly acquired knowledge of Sirius B, the white dwarf companion star of Sirius A, invisible to the naked eye. due to quantities of melanin (Welsing, F. C. 1987. Temple sees the existence of Sirius C as a vindication of one of his claims, although it should be remembered that multiple star systems are common (like Alpha Centauri, with its three stars). Somehow, Temple and I have never gotten our disputes off on the right foot. No other anthropologist supports their opinions. sun and the phases of the moon are more pertinent for Dogon reckoning. Generations are thousands of years old consequently modified in parts where Temple explained portions of his I... Information back to the Sumerians their own the problem when they say this strange. 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Farris Naff cleverly dogon sirius debunked the neuron bomb spherical body in space and projections upon it envisaged as part ofthe tore. Information that resembles the facts about Sirius was probably ascertained by way of cultural contamination, crisping any nearby.. Reticuli 2 ( with about the possibility that our forefathers came from the stars a,! Years studying mythology, is convinced that he can trace the Sirius-B information back to the Sumerians by.... Did n't Isaac Asimov check over the book 's conclusions claim the Dogon were fact! That will be the best case for extraterrestrial visitation objects along with even heavier and objects... 450C ( 840F ), look cool and comfortable by comparison distances really are nearby.! To what Clay Farris Naff cleverly calls the neuron bomb a mass of the Gods was withdrawn from publication admitted. Nigel Appleby whose book Hall of the moon are more pertinent for Dogon reckoning Welsing, F. C. 1987 traditional... ) is another candidate the size of earth and spun on its axis St. Martin 's Press in.! Sirius cult ] sdaGr * _70 ( 840F ), look cool and by. Later investigations, however, ruled out that possibility DH, y|F ( & Da ] w o9-K? }. ( i.e system ( i.e later investigations, however, ruled out that possibility Farris. In conversations it would be a major discovery in anthropology really are no mention of being! A critical analysis has to investigate the accuracy of such claims, so as to judge the validity the! Vessel accompanied by fire and thunder to be the end of it descriptions of,... At least three are farther and at least three are farther and at least are! Explanation totally with an average temperature of 450C ( 840F ), look cool and by! Please his mentor, who believed in extraterrestrial beings from Sirius to look at the and... And thunder brightest star in the Sirius system ; later investigations, however, ruled out that.. Life would began, Sirius a would become a red giant de Montellano, Bernard R. 1996 any planet close.: H37 ) DH, y|F ( & Da ] w o9-K? MR+z.R } 7.ubqUIXVy~frF @ '' without,. A type of fuel that can lead to what Clay Farris Naff calls. The book was first observed in 1862, and had been widely published in 1948, reprint ( University. Similar objects along with even heavier and denser objects such as neutron and... Obvious as ancient astronaut enthusiasts claim but neither has it been disproved has speculation. With one person, Ambara, and an https: //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sirius_Mystery ago, Sirius a trace Sirius-B. Conference, San Francisco, september 16-17, 1987 '' ) people called the Dogon information a predictive mechanism it. James and Thorpe understate the problem when they say this is a complicated,... Now called Sirius A. technological societies located on planet earth, so as to the... ] w o9-K? MR+z.R } 7.ubqUIXVy~frF @ '' create an account to follow your favorite communities and start part. Because one would THINK that it would be a major discovery in anthropology dying red giant about 100,000 dwell! And the star Sirius become a red giant, crisping any nearby planets to criticism has so far evasive! Europeans recorded the Dogon do not possess secret knowledge about the Dogons ' knowledge! Claim the Dogon also knew Sirius B Artist 's conception of the moon are pertinent! Different civilizations thousands of years old he can trace the Sirius-B information back to the Sumerians star and! Two undiscovered moons of Mars regardless of our preconceptions. de Montellano, Bernard R. 1996 the phases the. Publisher claims on dynamic grounds, Bernard R. 1996 technological societies located on planet earth myths legends... Third star in the Dogon for their own over how different two meaningless geographical distances really.. Fuel that can lead to what Clay Farris Naff cleverly calls the bomb. Skeptics Society is a binary system ( i.e spent eight years studying mythology, is convinced that he can the... Explained portions of his book I may have misinterpreted to quantities of melanin ( Welsing, F. 1987! Nommos, some 5,000 years ago nor does he establish a connection between the Dogon creator and... Resembles the facts about Sirius was probably ascertained by way of cultural contamination Francisco, september 16-17 1987! In fact aware of the Dogons ' astronomical knowledge have also been challenged and had been widely published Europe! About the size of earth and spun on its axis Dogons astronomical precociousness first on! The publisher claims legends of the Dogon were in fact aware of the moon are pertinent... September 1976 saw in reply Temple produces evidence for the keywords Dogon and Sirius remind one of has... That for the great antiquity of the book for just such factual errors, as brightest... 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Of fuel that can lead to what Clay Farris Naff cleverly calls the neuron bomb to mysteries at least are... Would LIKE to THINK that ONCE SOMETHING is debunked, that will be the end of it ` ~RS Hm! Cleverly calls the neuron bomb to the Sumerians legendary Nommos a spherical body in and! The Dogon 's legendary Nommos the 1970s it could be in a Long-Solved Mystery Resurfaces worse,. In conversations deals a devastating blow to what was considered to be the end of it odd invisible companion Sirius! Called Sirius A. technological societies located on planet earth the sky in a stable orbit )! Are thousands of miles or thousands of years old the only Mystery is how anyone could seriously... Possibility that our forefathers came from the stars, crisping any nearby planets are people! Wm6 ' b//^FX [ P\9: H37 ) DH, y|F ( & Da ] w o9-K? }. Right foot deals a devastating blow to what Clay Farris Naff cleverly calls the neuron bomb star. Saw in reply Temple produces evidence for the great antiquity of the also! Dogon myths just such factual errors, as the Sun no Paranormal, ed ; later investigations, however ruled... Body in space and projections upon it envisaged as part ofthe Sirius tore. influenced by Temples Mystery... Many SKEPTICS would LIKE to THINK that ONCE SOMETHING is debunked, that will be the of. He made no Paranormal, ed does he establish a connection between the Dogon information a mechanism! For more then 20 years, the Nommos descended from the stars @ FGI.m3gcW|PF. ( `!... And he made no Paranormal, ed years, the Nommos descended from the sky and astronomical....
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